Episode 2 introduced us to Giana Petrichella. A brand advocate with a decade long career in marketing. Giana was an insightful guest that spoke about her experience with layoffs, what she was looking for, what she would change, and a very interesting experience in interviewing for a role.
Here is how host Marissa Alonzo-Ackerman and Giana Petrichella began the conversation and the following is a summary of that call.
“ Ten years is a good amount of time, but there are plenty of people who have longer careers than me and I think about those people a lot…even those entry level folks…it’s a time where its affecting literally everybody in every type of level of their career.” Giana says that the impact of layoffs have been negative at times, but she focuses on staying positive.
“I am not immune to the mental struggles, feeling of inadequacy, and worrying about my finances…I am the main breadwinner in my household and a parent as well.” Her outlook has helped her try to focus on the next potential step and be hopeful of the outcome. She wants to be able to possibly laugh at this situation down the road and to that Marissa agreed (somewhat lol).
“We don’t have a crystal ball but I would hope that would be the case at some point.”
As the conversation continued Giana and Marissa spoke about how the podcast has been trying to shake off or change the narrative that “nobody wants to work”, something that Marissa is passionate about and says is not the case. One thing for certain they agreed on is that the way we have modeled society for so long is actually quite the opposite—people are begging to work.
“I think that at the end of the day, everyone really does want to do good work…I am sure there are outliers out there in the world, but I think overall everyone really does want to produce good work because that is our livelihood.”
The human aspect being a topic of conversation helped Marissa and Giana dive in deeper to the overall experience she has had. As more and more people continue to be laid off and with scarce financial means, unemployment and additional services have become the norm, which is something Giana also has been leaning into to keep her finances in order.
“Going through unemployment has been such an experience,” she said.
But Giana is motivated. Putting in hundreds upon hundreds of applications thus far, she says she is ready to work and will continue to do what she needs to do, not only because it is required by unemployment but because she is actively looking for her next company. One thing she notes is that there has been a disconnect on LinkedIn in the way we view some jobseekers. The desperation of jobseekers being the bulk of main viral posts while stories of individuals that are going through the process get lost in the void.
“There is a gap and I think you are fulfilling it in this podcast where we typically are seeing [posts] on LinkedIn where they are newly let go or just at the peak of the layoff, then you see the major desperation…this is for the in between moments.”
Marissa talked shortly about her experience as a newly laid off individual in her first few months and commiserated with Giana. The fact remains that the social platform site, LinkedIn has so much postings regarding layoffs but going viral can be hard. The burnout is truly real, they both continued. Marissa even further elaborated in what she sees at times— everyone is feeling burnt out, everyone is feeling anxious, and everyone feels stretched thin.
The conversation then turned into how that experience can impact the way you feel going into your job interviews when you finally get them. After hundreds upon hundreds of applications put in, switching to the corporate hat when the time comes can be tricky.
“I have to put on my corporate hat. I have to put on my career hat. I haven’t been doing this for a few weeks and months…did I forget the lingo, an acronym…you kind of just like freeze for a second no matter how much you prepare," said Giana.
The burn out continues on then at every stage of the job placement process. Marissa alluded to episode 3 (stay tuned!) and says a common theme she is seeing is how applying and interviewing for a job is a full time unpaid job and coupled with your everyday duties, as parents and caregivers or whatever your lifestyle is like, it can be doubly challenging.
“It takes hundreds of applications to even have one interview,” said Marissa. Giana says that during this timeframe it is best to treat yourself with grace. Giana feels strongly that this coupled with the acceptance of the situation can help you cope, however there are certain processes that she would like to see change and says that starts from the top.
“No matter how you cut it, it starts from the top down…so those that are in leadership positions and those that sort of rule our world, I mean that’s the reality,…leaders, I don’t know if there is anyway to really incentivize them than just being educated enough to be able to hear people’s stories, because at the end of the day happy employees do circle back to a happy work environment and therefore can produce a very fruitful organization, I firmly believe that,” said Giana.
Agreeing on this matter Marissa spoke highly about those organizations and companies that have stuck with that strategy and how it correlates to the ones you see that are currently thriving. Transparency with salary for example being one of the talked about metrics of positive experiences with employees that Giana has found to support this claim.
“I think we need to lean into that…as much transparency as possible,” said Giana.
Giana explained to her that this begins in the interview process, which is influenced by stakeholders and often time leaders. Leaders that are inundated with their mission and vision that cannot water and cultivate their staff or have flippant strategies are often at the helm of any issues down the road.
As they discussed further this matter it was made known that they know and are hopeful that these companies that are successful and empathetic are listening or will be listening in on these episodes. The hope being that those companies that value individuals, will be in touch with our jobseekers.
Further diving into the current state of things Marissa stated “We know business is business, that is just a fact, that is reality but there are different ways to go about it and we do see those success stories.”
One business in particular, H-E-B grocery store, is shared about as an example of a company that continues to do something right and is successful enough that people will talk about them in a positive way for years after.
“In this day and age your employees likely are your customers, and your customers are likely your employees…there is so much overlap. Take any company out there…the likelihood that your friend, or your family, or you have a connection to that product or service is real, we live in a day and age where information is at the click of a button.”
Referencing once again the interview process, the term “say what you mean and mean what you say” came to mind for Giana.
Sharing the reality of what your job requires can even get you referrals as Giana explained she had been contacted for jobs she knew was not in her wheelhouse but referred out to friends that she knew could hit the mark.
The conversation then turned towards mission and the value it has. She explained how in the startup world many in the space are well aware of the changing nature and the openness of the conversations with recruiters could help candidates better understand what is to come and how the business is aligning their goals strategically and realistically for each phase.
Speaking on transparency even further, the conversation circled back to Giana’s most recent interview situation and she reflected on how it made her feel and what they could have done differently. Giana explained to us how a certain large and very well known company had recently put her through a long interview process that started back in June.
“A friend of mine had moved on from this position and recommended me because our backgrounds were similar,” she stated in how she got introduced to the role.
Originally she said they explained to her that the role would be fairly identical to what her friend was doing prior and it gave her some context initially about what they were looking to do.
“It felt like a win-win situation,” said Giana.
She felt as if it was simply a backfill and that the timeline could possibly be accelerated, although she said she did appreciate the fact that a two month time frame of interviewing wasn’t terrible.
“I did not want to just rush into a role,” she explained.
After seven rounds of interviews, a conversation with different stakeholders, and a shuffle to align calendars, she found herself not completely understanding the scope of the role as time went by.
“I understand the title, I understand the department it rolls up into. I have a general understanding of the scope of responsibilities but even when I asked multiple times…I asked for specificity... give me a project, tell me a current issue that is going on right now that would be on my plate...,” she found herself a bit confused.
She believes that her intentionality in trying to understand and get a clearer vision of what the role was going to look like intimidated her interviewers. Marissa agreed that this could often be the case at times, especially as women, saying her own intentionality with questions in past companies have always been from a place of understanding or trying to ensure that she knew what the actual goal or mission was to then produce the best results but sometimes was met with disdain.
“It’s no different, though, than them asking —give me an example of when you ran into a project that you worked on with X stakeholders and what was that outcome. They want specificity, I want specificity,” said Giana.
The outcome of this specific situation resulted in the recruiter updating her that the role had been demoted in both title and salary, but Giana said because it was a role that had some learning opportunities that she still had interest. She said that she understood that through the interview process their team must have reviewed and realized they had originally misaligned intentions and where it fit into their company framework.
She was quickly disheartened shortly after, though, when they decided that not only were they going to lower the scope of the role, decrease the salary, but they also were making a contingency clause that anyone in the role could not apply to internal opportunities for promotion for an entire year and a half.
Marissa touched on the fact that this result made her feel as if this meant that the company was not being strategic financially and that they were possibly holding the position to see how the business would do going forward. Something she had seen in the past with other companies.
The irony for Giana was that she knows someone that currently works there and they stated that the company generally promotes growth. Her conclusion was that they obviously didn't know what they wanted, they are (still) trying to make a decision, but since they are such a large company with multiple stakeholders they are not seeing it move in the way that they thought and that the contingency only helps them in the long run.
As the saga continues Giana is thinking through her negotiation and what that means for her going forward with this particular company. She says that if a company can add a contingency then so should a jobseeker or employee.
“I may propose to them, alright if you’re going to set a contingency, then I want you to be able to guarantee my employment for a year,” said Giana.
The idea of companies and jobseekers creating partnerships need to be collaborative, they ended the conversation stating.
“If you do not know what you really want, put it on hold,” said Marissa.
Lastly, Giana did say she is still #opentowork and she is looking for roles in brand and brand development. She started in events and related verticals. She has had the privilege of working with other marketing funnels such as public relations, comms, web, and legal. Depending on how organizations are running she is adaptive and flexible and great at working with teams.
If you know of anyone that needs a marketer who has strategic and realistic goals in mind, Giana might just be that perfect fit. View her profile on LinkedIn.
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